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Old 07-29-2010, 01:06 PM   #21
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Granny wasn't traded to the Argos until 1972. He won the GC with the Stamps in 1971 but was listed as an O-Lineman though I thought that while in Calgary he only played DL....
Liggins was a little guy in comparison to the other three players. There was one other DL that played & I can't remember his name.
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Old 07-29-2010, 01:30 PM   #22
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Liggins was a little guy in comparison to the other three players. There was one other DL that played & I can't remember his name.
I'm pretty sure you are referring to Fred James. Part of the biggest, strongest, fastest D-line in the CFL at the time...
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Old 07-29-2010, 01:35 PM   #23
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I'm pretty sure you are referring to Fred James. Part of the biggest, strongest, fastest D-line in the CFL at the time...
Fred James is correct! I think he was the reason Liggins was moved to OL. For its day that was a big, mean & tough defensive line. Thank you, BRM!!
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Old 07-29-2010, 03:12 PM   #24
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Granny wasn't traded to the Argos until 1972. He won the GC with the Stamps in 1971 but was listed as an O-Lineman though I thought that while in Calgary he only played DL....

Liggins was actually traded in 1973 to the Argonauts for, irony of ironies, Leon McQuay.

Granville was shifted over to the o-line from DT in training camp in 1971.

I remember being there at camp that June when Liggins and the rest of the o-line hopefuls jogged past us spectators at a Stampeders practice in the hot sun and I nearly keeled over with the odour emmanating from all of those hard-working guys... Up until that age, I didn't know any group of people could smell like that!

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Old 07-29-2010, 04:19 PM   #25
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Liggins was actually traded in 1973 to the Argonauts for, irony of ironies, Leon McQuay.

Granville was shifted over to the o-line from DT in training camp in 1971.

I remember being there at camp that June when Liggins and the rest of the o-line hopefuls jogged past us spectators at a Stampeders practice in the hot sun and I nearly keeled over with the odour emmanating from all of those hard-working guys... Up until that age, I didn't know any group of people could smell like that!

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lol. Murphy just got into a lot of trouble posting something similar to this. If I didn't know any better I would guess that you're an anti-hoggite..
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Old 07-29-2010, 05:04 PM   #26
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lol. Murphy just got into a lot of trouble posting something similar to this. If I didn't know any better I would guess that you're an anti-hoggite..
Not at all similar.

I think you missed the point.

I wasn't singling out any "group of people" for prejudicial comment (unless you consider offensive linemen an "identifiable group" and foul odour to be unworthy of comment).

If you re-read what I posted, I wasn't singling out Liggins (or blacks for that matter), since everyone in that group of guys who trotted past us spectators (except for Liggins) were all white players...and they and Liggins as a group all smelled bad!

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Old 07-29-2010, 05:13 PM   #27
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Didn't "Granny" come in at around 6'0" or 6'1" and about 220-230? Or am I thinking about someone else?
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Old 07-29-2010, 05:25 PM   #28
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Old 07-29-2010, 06:50 PM   #29
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Didn't "Granny" come in at around 6'0" or 6'1" and about 220-230? Or am I thinking about someone else?
I think his stats were in the order of 6'1" and 225 (so right in the range, Bronks ) which in those days was "plenty big".

I think once he started on the offensive line he was forced to "bulk up" all the way to about 235-240, which really hurt the quickness and reflexes for which he was known when he played defence.

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Old 07-29-2010, 07:53 PM   #30
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Granny was a veritable GIANT compared to an old Bomber offensive guard named Ed Kotowich....

The late Eddie stood only 5'8.5" and weighed in no more than 200-205. Yet, he was an amazing tiger for the bombers....during much of their heyday.

Can't remember too many other smallish guys like that. Bombers had a guy I named Skinny Dan Gyetvai who was 6'7" and 230 when he first arrived in bomber camp. How do you even draft a guy that thin?
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Old 07-29-2010, 11:03 PM   #31
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Back in the 60's, 6 foot 235-240lb linemen were the average. Guys like Bill Frank & Clyde Brock were the exceptions in those days. Those guys were 6'6 & 275 lbs. The early prototypes of what would become OL of today.
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Old 07-29-2010, 11:37 PM   #32
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Back in the 60's, 6 foot 235-240lb linemen were the average. Guys like Bill Frank & Clyde Brock were the exceptions in those days. Those guys were 6'6 & 275 lbs. The early prototypes of what would become OL of today.
Which is exactly why Liggins had to "bulk up" to play the position...since he had played lighter and quicker and with a lot of success on the defensive line before the shift.

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Old 07-29-2010, 11:56 PM   #33
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Which is exactly why Liggins had to "bulk up" to play the position...since he had played lighter and quicker and with a lot of success on the defensive line before the shift.

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The CFL is all about quickness today. Granny Liggins is one of those few players from 40 years ago who I believe could still be an impact player if he played in today's CFL. At 225 lbs he was too small to play against the huge OL of today but what a dynamite linebacker he'd have made!!
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Old 07-30-2010, 05:43 AM   #34
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I still like the names that I heard when I was living in Edmonton. It went something like this: "Frickin Flutie to Pitts again!!! Oh man do we ever suck." I always liked the Sponge, I even named my cat after him.
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Old 07-30-2010, 11:06 AM   #35
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Old 08-01-2010, 10:01 PM   #36
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Fred James is correct! I think he was the reason Liggins was moved to OL. For its day that was a big, mean & tough defensive line. Thank you, BRM!!
Liggins was moved to the OL for team injury reasons. James was a very average canadian at best. When Granny came up he was highly touted by considered too small to play in the NFL. He was outstanding in his rookie year that anchored a dline that did not include James. Helton joined the following year. There were 3 imports and Sudermann. Liggins, Luzzi, Helton and Suderman. Koinzan was a back up as was James. I think James didnt start until 72 but by then the team was on its down ward spiral. Their dline outside of Helton and Koinzan was poor at best as Suderman was traded to the Esks and Liggins then an OL was traded for McQuay
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Old 08-04-2010, 12:08 PM   #37
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The Big Tuna!
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My personal favorites:
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Old 08-05-2010, 07:14 AM   #38
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Old 08-05-2010, 09:56 AM   #39
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Not at all similar.

I think you missed the point.

I wasn't singling out any "group of people" for prejudicial comment (unless you consider offensive linemen an "identifiable group" and foul odour to be unworthy of comment).

If you re-read what I posted, I wasn't singling out Liggins (or blacks for that matter), since everyone in that group of guys who trotted past us spectators (except for Liggins) were all white players...and they and Liggins as a group all smelled bad!

TM
Didn't miss the point at all. Wasn't accusing you of being racist just an anti-hoggite. And yes I do consider offensive linemen an identifiable group. Just thought I was being funny. I sometimes miss the mark though, just ask my wife...
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Old 08-05-2010, 06:31 PM   #40
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Didn't miss the point at all. Wasn't accusing you of being racist just an anti-hoggite. And yes I do consider offensive linemen an identifiable group. Just thought I was being funny. I sometimes miss the mark though, just ask my wife...

That's okay, BRM, I'll accept that you didn't misconstrue my remarks as being racist in nature (which is not what I had originally concluded when you linked what I had posted to Murphy's twitter remarks from a few days earlier...)

And for the record I'm not even "anti-hog" (unless a group of 'em happen to jog past me on a practice field on an extremely warm day...)

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